Hell yes. Quit yer bitchin’.

Syncaine, I’m in total agreement. Eve’s skill point system is far from a handicap for new players. In fact, it’s the newbie-friendliest advancement system in any current MMO.

I posted almost a year ago that Eve Online is a casual mmorpg, and I still believe that. It offers the most accessible, most laid-back mmorpg experience possible, if you choose to play that way. The strength of Eve is that you can play it any way you want. Clearly, it’s not just a casual game. You can be an absolute min/max spreadsheet-creazy hardcore PvP lunatic in Eve as well, which is one of CCP’s great achievements.

However, Syncaine’s exactly right. You can fly alongside friends who have been playing for years almost instantly, definitely by the time your 14 day free trial is ending. There’s no other mmorpg on the market that offers that kind of flexibility. You can fulfill a variety of useful roles, depending on the needs of your friends, with a minium amount of training time.

You want to be immediately equal in strength to people who have already been playing for months, or for years? Go play Team Fortress 2, or any other FPS multiplayer game. You don’t want to play an mmorpg. People who think the skill point system in Eve is a handicap haven’t carefully considered what you’d have to do to catch up in any other level-based MMO.

Why is it ok for level-based mmorpg’s to make you advance to the end cap to play alongside your friends who have already been there for years, but Eve somehow gets attacked for what turns out to be a better, more flexible, system? If I wanted to start playing WoW now, and play with my friends from the Well, it’d be months and months before I’d be high enough level and geared properly to actually make a contribution.

I’d like to see Eve’s model used more widely in MMO design. I’m hoping whatever they do with the White Wolf IP has a similar skill system.

I’m not going to repeat all the things you can do in Eve at a very low skill point level, because Syncaine already covered it in the post I linked to up above. I did want to say I’m in complete agreement, though. Well said.


4 Responses

  1. While I don’t agree with everything, the Eve skill point system does offer Eve an easy way to keep new players caught up. They can up the amount of starting SP without having the player skip content.

  2. I like the system, but in EVE’s “no breaks for the new guy” it means months of nothing more than skill training before you even remotely have a chance to contribute. Anyone that argues otherwise has not played EVE outside of safe space and has therefore missed the majority of EVE’s actual gameplay.

    Also, most of Syncaine’s argument is not restricted to EVE. Players can, and often do, meet up and do things together in MMOs. Some MMOs just offer a more structured way for players to “fit” into the game, while others like EVE simply leave it open.

    Anyways, I dare a newbie to bring that frigate to a 0.0 sector to help in a mining op. 9 out of 10 times that newbie is going home, podded by the very “corp” that invited him out to help.

    I want to love EVE as the MMO I’ve always wanted. I just can’t. CCP has let the bad apples destroy the game IMHO.

  3. Actually, during my original 14 day trial, I saw a few level 4 missions, went on a a mining Op using a donated mining frig, got blown up multiple times scouting low sec for my Corp (all fully paid for), actually managed to dodge some pirates during one said scouting missions, and overall had a blast.

    What was most shocking to me was the fact that I could join any group, and it never felt like taking someones spot, something I was very much use to having managed 40 man raids in WoW.

    That whole ‘months of training’ thing is a total myth.

  4. Heartless, you’re making a very narrow “You can’t do this” argument. Yes, it’s impossible for a brand-new player with no contacts in the game to get out to 0.0 to help out with a corp operation. And yes, it’s possible to get scammed by a corp “recruiting” you to come to 0.0 to help.

    However, there are many, many more things to do as a two-week old player in Eve than any other MMO. Take Syncaine’s example. Take my experiences in Eve University, being involved in fleet operations in a war-time setting. Sure, it’s an Empire war, but a) it’s an absolute blast, and b) it’s awesome training.

    Syncaine said “What was most shocking to me was the fact that I could join any group, and it never felt like taking someones spot…”.

    Other MMO’s don’t allow that. With a fixed group member cap, you can’t just add one more player to help with a specific task. You’re seriously handicapping a WoW group by adding a level 60 player to a level 70 raid or Battleground group, let alone a level 30 or 40 player.

    You said other MMO’s offer a more structured way for players to “fit” into the game. How does a level 30 player “fit” into an endgame group in other MMO’s? It’s quite possible I’m missing valid examples, which might help me understand where you’re coming from.

    One thing I can think of might be a mentoring or sidekick system. I know CoH does it, and I think EQ2 does it as well (or maybe it’s EQ, or both). Does mentoring raise the lower-level player to the higher level player’s level, or vice versa?

    “I want to love EVE as the MMO I’ve always wanted. I just can’t. CCP has let the bad apples destroy the game IMHO.”

    That could be true; I don’t have enough experience in 0.0 to argue that. What has CCP allowed that destroyed the game?

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